Niches Suck And Other Heresies

Many copywriters often talk about targeting a niche… getting to know them so you talk their language and describe your solution for them as though you were one of them.

I’d like to take a contrarian view.

I think it’s silly to worry about targeting a “niche.”

I propose that all people are the same at their core and if you are actually working a true market… targeting is as silly as pretending that some people don’t eat or sleep or have sex or breathe.

I’m writing this from Costa Rica where my family and I are spending a couple of months. Some would say that Costa Rica and Costa Ricans are about as different as you can get from America and Americans.

Are they?

Certainly it is difficult to imagine being able to sell them something without speaking Spanish. Certainly it would be difficult to get them to purchase drought insurance (it rains daily this time of year).

But, as I was eating dinner tonight deep within a Tico (i.e., a Costa Rican) neighborhood at a soda (small restaurant) that had no other foreigners in attendance other than my family, I watched my two year old playing with the other children.

He had no idea that they didn’t speak English. They had no idea that he didn’t speak Spanish. They communicated just fine… mostly with screams and giggles and smiles… with the occasional shove and pointing.

Us parents also communicated just fine with smiles and talking to our own children when they got a little too aggressive. All of us were having a great time.

Everyone in the restaurant was enjoying the food… some the beer… most the socialization… most the music.

Was there any difference between this scene and similar scenes across Europe, Asia, Africa or science stations near the south pole? Of course there were, but the root drivers of human activity are all the same.

I’ve long been a hater of the word “niche” and how many in the industry teach folks to try out tiny little niche markets.

I think that’s hogwash.

First of all, those teachers are hypocrites. Are they working a tiny little “niche” or are they working the huge “make more money” market?

Secondly, anyone can take a look at the 10 richest people in the world and see that they worked in huge markets that apply to nearly every human on earth… not tiny little niches.

Bill Gates works the software market… the more generic and widely applicable, the better. His most profitable products are Windows and Microsoft Office which apply to a vast number of potential customers around earth.

Warren Buffet works the huge “investment” or “make money with money” market. Who doesn’t want to make more money? It’s hardly a niche.

The Walton family (i.e., Walmart) works in the “everything” market and promises lower prices. Who doesn’t want lower prices?

The list goes on. Niches are for those who want to replace a job with their own business that becomes a job. The rich and the free work in huge markets.

Huge markets need very little or no targeting. They apply to everyone or at least a large percentage of the population.

Almost everyone wants to live longer. Almost everyone wants to make more money, be more beautiful, have a closer relationship with their spouse, have loving, wonderful children, be stronger, more attractive, etc.

On the Internet, the world is your play place.

You can choose to follow the liars and hypocrites and try to make the four people who are into zebra hockey in New Orleans on Tuesday nights happy… or you can try to make the billions of earth inhabitants who want to live longer happy.

Have you ever tried to play darts?

If your target is that tiny little dot in the center, then you will only hit it sometimes. But if all four walls, the ceiling and the floor are all your target, then you actually have a fairly tough time not hitting your target.

Douglas Adams once wrote that it’s easy to fly. Just jump off anything and miss the ground. That’s why niches suck… and I’m a confirmed heretic.

About the Author

A former engineer in validation statistics, James Brausch is passionate about uncovering highly profitable sales and marketing processes that 99% of marketers overlook. He is the creator of countless software programs that are vigorously proven to dramatically boost business with far less guesswork and gruntwork. For more, visit his site at JamesBrausch.com.

Last 5 Posts by James Brausch

Michel Fortin Sucks…

Share This Post

Share this post with a friend by clicking "share this" below. You may freely reprint or redistribute this article, provided the content and links are left intact, and the "about the author" section is included. Get notified of new posts by RSS or email, below.

Like this? Click here to buy me a coffee.

Confessions Of A Website Copywriter

New! Possibly the Internet's best copywriting ebook on how to write proven sales copy for the Internet, from writing and web design, to testing. Highly recommended! Click for more »

Readers Also Viewed

Posted by James Brausch on September 17th, 2007. Filed in Articles, Contributions, Marketing. Tagged as contrarian, copywriter, Copywriting, costa rica, heresy, human, hypocrisy, james brausch, market, Marketing, niche, spanish, targeting. Follow responses through the RSS feed. Leave a response, or trackback from your own site.

34 Replies to “Niches Suck And Other Heresies”

Trackbacks/Pingbacks

From Internet Business 101 » Would You Do Me A Favor?

[...] http://www.michelfortin.com/niches-suck-and-other-heresies/ [...]
Reply Quote

Source Website September 18th, 2007
From Tech Tips for Online Business Success - The Weblog of StepLively Live Chat for Sales and Support

[...] I came across the article Niches Suck, I had a [...]
Reply Quote

Source Website September 20th, 2007
From Jacob Jans.Com » Why the Father of Modern Advertising Says Humility Matters Most

[...] to have a lot of respect for internet marketing guru James Brausch. But that was until he publicly called most internet marketers ‘liars and hypocrites.’ Now, it wasn’t the name calling that offended me. It was [...]
Reply Quote

Source Website September 25th, 2007
From Copywriting tips for online marketing success from Copyblogger

[...] the long tail holding you [...]
Reply Quote

Source Website October 13th, 2007
From Randy Roedl On Wordpress Blogs

[...] the long tail holding you [...]
Reply Quote

Source Website October 13th, 2007

Comments

From John Lovehaur

Just a couple of other glitches in the niches topic:

How many times have I seen “gurus” advertise “10 Hidden Niches for You to Exploit” or some such nonsense. Right, like whoever else bought the ebook in the last two years didn’t already.

It’s really a gas when they try to sell you resell rights to the ebook, too. Sure. Assuming you find a great niche to exploit, then you are supposed to sell the material to others so they can crowd you out?

I agree with you James. I’d rather swim in an ocean than a puddle.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Paul

First up James I’m really glad you have taken your family to see that other ways to live are available outside the US of A. Its a great big world!

The build a niche, find a niche, exploit a niche is more of the rubbish from the people who peddle dreams to vulnerable people who are just trying to improve their lives. I seem to recall this mania got started with the adsense gold rush.

James is bang on in my opinion. Dont build a Niche build a real lasting business. Instead of buying anymore Niche junk get yourself on to the search engine of you choice and type in “Blue Ocean Strategy”. It may change the way you view your business.

Paul
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Mike

Silly debate - there are business strategies that focus on going deep in a niche market. There are equally valid business strategies that focus on going wide in a mass appeal market. One can succeed or fail with either approach. To argue that one is right and the other is wrong is like trying to prove that apples are better than oranges.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Jack Keifer

James, the “dart” analogy is right on the money and with that, you hit the double bullseye! It’s amazing to see the number of people who buy into the small “niche” philosophy over & over again and still they never see the obvious. The obvious fact that they just purchased from someone who’s playing a BIG market themselves.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Robert

I agree and disagree. How’s that for waffling? You’re absolutely right about the gurus who preach niche markets when they themselves operate in the huge “opportunity market” or “make money market” or whatever it’s called. They say one thing and do another.

On the other hand, if I remember correctly you made a post on your Internet Business Blog a long time ago about McDonald’s being in the food business. I don’t argue that Mc Donald’s is in the food business and it’s a huge market. But wouldn’t the food market also include high-end restaurants like Ruth Chris Steakhouse, mid-end sit down restaurants like Applebees, and even grocery stores?

At some level, I’d say McDonald’s does compete against a high-end steakhouse, an Applebees, and a grocery store for your food dollar but McDonald’s is focused on a specific part of the food market - the fast-food market. Couldn’t that be considered a niche market? Maybe. Maybe not. It’s a market within a market but the fast-food market is huge too. So maybe this just serves to prove your point.

But in many cases, it can be more profitable to focus on a smaller market. I think of the examples of offering some type of service for medical offices. A generic service for every medical office might be priced at X but when the service is specifically targeted at a niche market like cosmetic surgeons or dentists the same service can often sold for some multiple of X - 3X, 5X, 10X, or more. And the end result is higher profits from focusing on a smaller market - a niche market if you want to call it that.

I guess it all depends on your goals and how you look at the situation. In some situations the right approach might be to be all things to all people. Like you say, Microsoft does pretty well in the huge software market.

In other situations, it might be better to focus on a smaller niche market. Sure Warren Buffet operates in the huge investment market but he won’t invest in businesses he doesn’t understand so he’s limiting the market somewhat. He never got into the .com stocks because he didn’t understand them so as far as I know he missed out on Google. He could have made another huge fortune if he’d have bought Google years ago but Google is not in his segment (niche?) of the larger investment market.

Different strokes for different folks. Some people spell it “tomato” others spell it “tomatoe” and they’re both right.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From F.J. Shark

Yes, we wasted a lot of time focusing on:

“Grow rich in a niche.”;

…when we should’ve been focusing on the old phrase:

“If you sell to the masses, you eat with the classes.”

-F.J. Shark
http://www.WomenFiguredOut.com
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Wesley Anderson

I think we need to clarify what a niche is. According to dictionary.com, it is a “a distinct segment of a market”. So you’ve got an industry (computers), a market (laptops) and a niche (laptops for teenage girls, laptops for graphic designers, laptops for gamers etc).

James is right that the “guru” teaching over the last few years has been to go after micro niches like underwater basket weaving or whatever and that’s pretty much a waste of time. BUT it’s not always true that niche = small, it’s just that a niche is a defined segment of a larger market. And IMHO, if you are a new player in an an established market, it is wise to go after a segment of the market first.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Marc Liron MVP

Mmm……

I have read this severla times and just have to say I disagree.

Online I have many “niches” that I work in… they are all releated to Microsoft technologies.

BUT if I just had one big sign that said “Microsoft Technology” I would leave so much money on the table so to speak!

But by saying “Microsoft Office” and “Windows Vista” and “Windows XP” I can target specific segments/niches and be far more profitable…

Just my 2 cents.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Wayne Buckhanan

I’m unconvinced.

Your examples are of people who are currently targeting mass markets. Bill Gates started by focusing on a single product in a market so specialized there was really only one customer: IBM. Sam Walton started with a single store with a very specific market of those nearby.

I wholeheartedly agree that most “gurus” are not walking their talk. Did they do things differently when they were starting out? Certainly. Did they target “niche markets”? Most likely. Do they currently target a mass market? Almost certainly.

How do you start in a mass market without something that distinguishes you and appeals to at least a small segment of that market?

I’m still unconvinced, but I’m listening.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Brent Riggs

I like Macs. I like PC’s. Go Army! Navy all the way! White bread… no wheat. Tastes great - less filling.

Humans love to pick what THEY want, experience or are good at, and declare that as the “best” or “only” way.

Supermarkets don’t just sell BREAD… they sell flavored toothpicks and squat lobster too. Walmart doesn’t just sell “mass items”… they sell little “niche” items too.

There is money and business in the broad and the narrow; in general and the specific… in the “mass” and the “niche” - in the “pond” and the “ocean”.

One ocean or ten thousand ponds. Different strokes for different folks.

The real genuis is, Fortin and Brausch cook up a non-issue debate to build exposure for themselves. There’s the REAL lesson in this posting.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Stephan Miller

God, I am glad someone said this. Niches have their place, but still I have made most of my money on huge over 1000 page sites. It is only recently I have tried niches.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Gray Schmidt

Always enjoy JB’s articles and blog posts that lambaste the so-called Internet Marketing ‘gurus’. I guess almost all has been said that needs to be said but - without the use of Glyphius 2007 to hone my copywriting in this instance (can’t you just tell :D) - I guess it is fair to observe that the broader the problem your products address the bigger your market (James succinctly summarizes those age-old marketer’s favorites) and hence, potentially, the bigger your sales.

But if we all came up with products that helped you live longer, made you more money,made you more beautiful, improved your marital & family bliss, improved health and fitness, etc…what a boring old Internet it would be…A perfect world, yes, but a boring Internet!

And of course such commentary coming from a Master exploiter of niche interests is always quite amusing!

Of course the more folks that eschew niches (or focused marketing) of their various ’specific interest’ products, the more money they’ll be leaving on the table for the likes of JB!

(And I note those pertinent comments from eminently successful niche website developer Marc Liron, who proves that JB’s premise must be flawed! Sorry, James, I still ‘luv’ that admonishingly-avuncular style of yours though!)

B.T.W., anyone got spare tickets for the next zebra hockey game in N.O.?

(P.S. How big is the market for CD recordings of Cost Rican thunderstorms, anyway?)
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Janice Sharman

I realized long ago that “niche marketing” was just a selling gimmick. It is good to see there are other people who agree with me. Go Brausch go…
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Tom Brownsword

As one who has been publicly flamed by JB on his blog for using the “niche” word in a question I asked him, I feel particularly qualified to comment…!!!

It’s all about perspective, and from mine, I’m fairly well convinced that trying to get people to discover “niches” is simply an effort to distract people from where the “markets” are. Do we want to target a “niche” or target a “market”? After purchasing a set of asbestos underwear, I think I’ve finally discovered that the whole “niche” thing is simply another attempt to throw nascent (and some not-so-nascent) marketers off the trail of true profits.

In other words, the whole “niche” thing seems to simply be an intimidation tactic designed to get newcomers to stay out of the large markets, where their ability to innovate and introduce some uniqueness to the market might just take enough market share from the “niche prophets” to hurt. Just throw the “noobs” a crumb while you feast on steak, in other words (and that seems to be the attitude sometimes, doesn’t it?).

Of course, you won’t have the market position of a Bill Gates or a Warren Buffet when starting out, but as a friend of mine in the promotional specialties business once said, how much of a multi-billion dollar market do you need to live well? The key is go get out there and get your market one person at a time — and let the market decide if your product is what you need. Do that in some artificial “niche” and you’ve effectively put a glass ceiling on your business.

Hasta luego,
Tom
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Jack Keifer

I think many readers are missing James’ point (or maybe I am :P). I think the point is to not center your entire business into one narrow niche. Sure, there is white bread, wheat bread, flavored toothpicks, etc. A grocery store sells them all. How much revenue do you think the store owner would generate if he/she wiped all their inventory out except for the flavored toothpicks? Now we’ve gone from Safeway to “Joe’s Flavored Toothpicks Emporium”. Doesn’t sound like a great plan to me.

Bill Gates doesn’t specialize in Windows OS only. Microsoft has a ton of products, ie- Office, Visual Studio, Foxpro, etc, all within the software market. Diversification within a market just makes more sense period, if you really want to make a civilized income.

The same applies to the Internet Opportunities market. Play with all the areas within that market if that’s your thing. Whether its weight loss, life extension, or whatever, there’s no need to focus on such a narrow piece of the pie.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Mike Moore

Niche or Mass Market? - The answer is yes. Either can be valid and profitable? Similarly, one can fail with either approach. This is still a silly debate.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Michel Fortin

My take? I think James’s post is a great take on a current trend that can be a bit misleading.

You see, what I’m taking from James’ post above is that he is mostly referring to the size of the niche. And the debate of the size of a niche is no different than the one about the size of a salesletter (i.e., short versus long copy).

It’s highly controversial if not misunderstood.

What James seems to have an aversion for is the “micro-niche,” the small ones that are great for snake oil salesman and one-hit wonders (people who come in, make enough sales to saturate the niche, and stagnate, close down or move on to the next one).

In fact, James says it specifically in the post:

“I’ve long been a hater of the word ‘niche’ and how many in the industry teach folks to try out tiny little niche markets.”

The goal, for example, of the whole underachiever method made popular by Frank Kern and Ed Dale was not to create underachiever sites. It was to create many of them. (And as James said, they are tackling the larger “how to make money” market with their approach.)

Plus, keep in mind, the product was the result of Frank trying to make money under the radar after his recent FTC debacle. He did it because he felt he had to. But after launching product after product in tiny, ultra-targeted niches, his “business” (and a business is much bigger than simply targeting a niche) is the sum total of applying this system.

However, the problem that arose from this is the same as the pervasiveness and wrongly applied processes, such as long copy, among others.

In this case, it’s that people who have bought into the whole micro-niche and underachiever system is they are now going after one or two tiny little niches and expect to make a fortune with them… and only them.

And that’s what I think James is referring to.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From John W. Furst

Good evening everybody!

Much misunderstanding in this whole debate stems from the fact that many talk, preach, praise, or condemn targeting “niche markets” down to a very emotional level, but who actually defines the term objectively?Almost nobody.

My favorite definition of the term “niche market” is a market sector (a part of the main market) with demand that is currently not covered to its full capacity by mainstream providers. Period. There are solid opportunities that comply with this definition. It does not imply that the demand, the market in this “niche”, is small nor does it imply that it is easy to go for. I’d say that’s the more academic definition, which I prefer. Those kind of niche markets might have the full potential to grow beyond our wildest dreams.

Marketing via SMS once was such a “niche market”. The small text messages that you can send with your GMS/UTMS mobile phone. Probably still more popular in Europe than in the US. The big telcos did not care, did not envision its potential, left it out. They thought the revenue potential is not worth it. A couple of years later small companies with proactive CEOs are controlling that portion of what has become a major market.

Well, that’s my understanding. How does this relate to the Internet Marketing Discussion? Stay tuned. I’ll write a second comment in a couple of minutes. — Yours John W. Furst
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From John W. Furst

Part 2:
In context with Internet Marketing — from my limited personal experience — the term “niche” mostly is related to “low competition”. That seems to be the primary acceptation. Better “gurus” or info products add another word. You probably have heard it many times, “profitable nice”. It has become the synonym or a mixed up synonym for higher organic search engine rankings, lower AdWords bid prices, “long tail”, and high conversion rates. Well, the term is sold that way. Is it true?

What I have learned in my very first internet marketing affiliate venture in the German market was that it also means very low traffic volume. I mean traffic that is that low in volume that you cannot even split test your Ads in a reasonable time frame. This example might not be a representative one, because the German market as such has additional shortcomings that diminish your potential earnings. Anyway, I have learned my lesson and abandoned that market altogether after three month and have not written any “German language” on the Internet since.

A “niche” in that sense might be profitable, but you could starve, while you are watching the dimes rolling in. — Yours John W. Furst and greeting from the Canary Islands/Spain.

P.S.: Forgive me for the long comments, but I was kind of in a flow. Good night.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Brennan Kingsland

As a relative “newbie”, I selected a niche site involving education reform. My market is very limited; only every caring parent, teacher and taxpayer in the United States. So there’s no point in my trying to approach a great big global community. Boo Hoo!

Even with my limited target market (you’ll note some sarcasm there), ROI is very difficult. So, I thought I would listen to the recommendations of those “lousy gurus” who tell newbies to focus on tiny niche markets. Following their plan, I made immediate sales in what will NOT be a long term market, but at least I got to see some desperately-needed green stuff.

Now I’m not giving up on my initial marketplace, but I have learned that I’m in for the “long haul” there.

Perhaps the mass market needs are more lucrative in the long run, but I’m grateful for a fast way to make money in small niche markets while I learn to be the next Bill Gates or Warren Buffet.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Sharon Vaz

I currently dominate a wedding niche in the search engines and my blog is considered an authority site on that subject. Through a great deal of testing with Crazy Egg, I’ve been able to tweak the blog structure and copy to convert at a high level. Also by not limiting myself to the core niche market, I’ve been able to successfully expand my customer base.

So I’m working on two levels: providing valuable information to the core customer base with back-end sales from a wedding accessories site and persuading the secondary audiences to incorporate my flagship product into their wedding ceremonies. In addition, I am expanding my product line by developing information products that cater to the needs of this unique market and I’m very excited about the potential for growth. While this niche is not my only source of income, it is certainly going to be a major contributor in the months to come. I want to thank Michel Fortin for his posts on the importance of copy testing. Even with his free information on this blog, I have used these tools to guide me in tweaking my content. As a result, I have seen dramatic sales increases in such a short period. I am all for creating micro sites built on WordPress that provide valuable information to a specific niche. These grow up into super achiever sites that pull in a high level of traffic, build trust and most importantly, convert into sales. Long live niche websites!
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 18th, 2007
From Grant A. Johnson

James is simply wrong. Relevancy is what matters most today and that relevancy begins with understanding niches — segments if you will.

I’d be happy to test against him anytime to prove the point.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 19th, 2007
From Charles Lamm

As an absolute scanner, I don’t stay focused on one marketing topic very long. That’s why I like affiliate marketing so much. If I get tired of satellite tv players, I can promote international dating sites five minutes later. The problem for scanners is when we have found what we came for in a particular niche, we are on to the next one. Rather than fight my nature, I now follow the path that was meant for me.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 19th, 2007
From Raj

Dear James,

If we will not Position our product or service for a specific market or group who will come to buy…? I believe that it’s important to get position (for a specific target market) of any product or service. Let customers decide how they view & utilize our product or service. If it’s spreading in mass…let them….if not let’s enjoy on that target market. What do you think?

You know? When we introduce our product range we focused only on Bakers. So that they can use of our raw materials or ingredients. We did not focus types of food makers. E.g. our product Tutti-Frutti is niche products being made for Ice-cream, Cake and Pastry makers….not for Burger or any other fast foods market. We are succeed with our niche position…..You are wel-come to visit to my site.

Raj.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 20th, 2007
From Liz

“as silly as pretending that some people don’t eat or sleep or have sex or breathe”

Actually, there ARE some people out there who don’t have sex… ;o)
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 20th, 2007
From Sorry

Sorry to hear about your problem Liz.
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 21st, 2007
From Liz

LOL
Reply Quote

Author's Website September 21st, 2007
From Eric

James, I have a question for you. Would you consider teaching public speaking skills a niche market?
Reply Quote

Author's Website October 14th, 2007
From Krista Johnson

What a great article. Ease to read and packed with useful content. Wondering if you’d be willing to back link to our company’s page? I thank you for your time and also for sharing your knowledge!!
Reply Quote

Author's Website October 17th, 2007

Your First Copywriting Client In 14 Days Or Less

New! Discover this copywriter's personal system for getting copywriting clients in as few as 14 days. It includes both online and offline marketing strategies. Click for more »

The only rule? Respect. Comments that contain meaningless content, abusive language, or personal attacks will be promptly deleted. Bullies, spammers, and faultfinders need not reply. Think twice before you post.